The RPGnet Interview
Shannon Appelcline: Welcome, Jay, and thanks for taking the time for this interview. Let’s dive right into your beginnings in gaming ... What got you into the field of roleplaying?
Jay Little: Like a lot of gamers, my entry point was Dungeons & Dragons, specifically the classic “red box” edition. This was probably when I was about eight years old. My older brother was the DM and ran me and some friends through many of my first rpg adventures.
Later, when my brother lost interest in D&D and roleplaying games, I got all his old books. That year for my birthday, my parents bought me a subscription to Dragon Magazine. Hook, line, sinker.
I’ve also got to say that the great Choose Your Own Adventure series and the TSR Endless Quest books sparked my imagination and steered me toward roleplaying games. I really enjoyed the experience where your decisions made a difference, where the reader was an active participant in the unfolding story, rather than a passive observer.
SA: I think a lot of us old-time roleplayers enjoyed Choose Your Own Adventure, Endless Quests and the more game-y books like Lone Wolf and Sorcery! in our younger days. On the roleplaying side of things, when did Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay enter your gaming experience, and what'd you think of it then?
JL: I first started playing Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay back in high school. The amazing art by John Blanche (like the Hrothyogg’s Tower colour plate), Wil Rees (love his Shadows over Bogenhafen piece), and others really struck a chord in me. The short flavour text intro, the excellent Oldenhaller Contract intro adventure – all of these factors worked together to present a very dark, grim, and dangerous setting. And the career system helped develop a very tangible connection among the characters and their place within the Old World.
Prior to WFRP, I had been used to playing RPGs where your characters are heroes willing to risk life and limb to rescue the princess or gain treasure. WFRP turned that on its head and offered a really dark place filled with dark powers pursuing their dark plans. Sometimes characters get caught up in the world around them and have to react or get crushed by the enigmatic wheels of Chaos.
It was such a ... visceral ... setting to GM for my players. It sort of opened up my eyes to what GM’ing could be about – actions could have very dire consequences. The good guys don’t always win. Sometimes the Big Bad really is that powerful and can’t be stopped, only contained or lessened.
SA: Fast-forward a number of years. How did you end up in charge of the Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay Third Edition project?
JL: In WFRP parlance, I totally booned a Daunting (4d) Charm check. Ok, dorkness aside, I’d like to think it was more than that.
I had been doing a lot of freelance rpg writing while working full-time as a technical consultant, curriculum writer, and software trainer. I was looking for something more fulfilling, and had been playing with the idea of diving back into game design full-time.
That’s when I noticed a posting on the FFG web site for a game development position. I applied for the job, had a few email exchanges about it, and then didn’t hear back for a bit. So I wrapped up a few more freelance contracts, then went back to my WFRP campaign with my friends, writing out the campaign ideas I had kicking around and getting a lot of gaming in.
Then I heard back from FFG, asking how familiar I was with the Warhammer Fantasy setting. Talk about kismet. After another brief email exchange, they made arrangements and flew me in to the Twin Cities for a formal interview. As a neat part of the interview process, I had been asked to write and present a short adventure for WFRP that would showcase my knowledge of the setting and my rpg game design chops. I had prepped maps, handouts, pre-generated characters, the full monty.
I’d like to think I made a favourable impression – when I got home after the flight back, there was a message waiting, offering me the position. Since then, my focus has been pretty much WFRP, WFRP, and more WFRP!
SA: What were your goals in creating the new edition of Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay?
JL: With the redesign of the rules engine and the development of a large boxed set, you can imagine that there were a lot of goals. Some of the goals were system-based, such as moving to a dice pool to create more organic results. But many of the goals were far less tangible. For example, providing an experience that evoked the Warhammer Fantasy feeling was an ever-present goal, and we regularly compared and evaluated what we have been working on to make sure it still felt appropriate for the setting.
There was also a very strong focus on integrating a narrative-driven approach. Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay was designed with a broad rules framework based on consistency between different game functions and applying common sense based on the current in-story circumstances. The rules were developed to empower GMs to easily modify, arbitrate, and manage the game within a set of simple guidelines, adjusting the game as he sees fit to deliver the best play experience for his group.
One of my personal goals was to integrate player and character risks and rewards into the game design. Allowing players to adjust their risk tolerance and accept greater risk for the potential payoff of greater rewards provides a lot of great opportunities for both story-telling and strategy. With the de-emphasis on tactical positioning and combat micro-management, the development of risks and rewards allows for a lot of interesting decisions to apply to combat encounters, but also influences how social and non-combat encounters are resolved.
SA: I was surprised by how abstract the combat system is, given discussions of the board game influences on WFRP3, but we can return to that whole topic in a bit. In the meantime, I'd like to hit upon some of the mechanics of the game.
You talked about the fact that the fact that the resolution system is mainly dice-based, not chart-based. You also alluded to ease of gamemastering--where a GM can just drop in additional fortune, misfortune, or challenge die to change the difficulty of a task--and to the conservative/aggressive stance system. Of all of these, or something else you haven't talked about yet, what mechanic makes you the happiest in WFRP3? What do you think works the best and why?
JL: I’m extremely pleased with how GM friendly the game is. Once the players get comfortable with the basics, they have a lot of resources they can draw on to weave into the game. The GM has so many options at his disposal, he can pick and choose the best tool for the current job.
Want to incentivize the players and reward them for good roleplaying and clever ideas? Provide the party some fortune points, assign some fortune dice, hand over narrative control of a scene, let them recover some stress or fatigue, or easily adapt one of numerous other factors on the fly -- whatever makes most sense for the story at the moment.
Players decide to go ahead and do something you weren’t expecting? You can introduce a rally step to get your bearings and think about what’s next. Or assemble an impromptu progress track to help manage some of the circumstances. Or roll a fortune and misfortune die and see if the players are lucky or unlucky with what transpires. Or toss in some extra challenge and misfortune dice, along with possible consequences for failure, and let them decide if it’s a risk worth undertaking.
SA: What were your main influences on the design?
JL: There are a lot of influences. Previous editions of Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay are obviously very strong influences – I played 1st and 2nd edition a lot. My long history with the setting and experience with the previous editions played a significant role in the development of the new edition. In fact, I’ve still got a lot of my 1st edition character sheets and handouts from when I was both a player and a GM.
I’ve also been a rabid consumer of the Warhammer Fantasy setting through various media – I’ve read dozens and dozens of the novels over the years (Drachenfels and the Blackhearts fiction are personal favorites), I’ve played the table top game, related board games, and many of the Warhammer-themed computer games (and have a soft spot in my heart for the maddeningly difficult Shadow of the Horned Rat).
Outside of the depth of GW-based products, quite a few other roleplaying games influenced my design. Some of them simply by virtue of being games I played quite a bit or being games that expanded my view of what roleplaying games could be and what they can offer as a gameplay experience. Others by providing an interesting take on mechanics or interactions that I found particularly refreshing or inspiring.
Here are a few that come to mind:
- Ars Magica
- Call of Cthulhu
- Deadlands
- Don’t Rest Your Head
- Everway
- Hollow Earth Expedition
- InSpectres
- Little Fears
- Marvel SAGA System
- My Life with Master
- Primetime Adventures
- Shadowrun
JL: Three specific examples come to mind. TSR’s Marvel SAGA System was a big influence to the color-coded nature of the game, and associating various tasks or attributes with a specific color. Marvel SAGA’s use of its color-coded deck of cards, with each color/suit corresponding to a specific attribute or approach, really makes that game hum. And its inclusion of a Doctor Doom suit representing possible immediate short-term benefit at the risk of long-term peril was brilliant.
Games with stunts, bennies, and other immediate player rewards were very influential when developing fortune points and shaping GM advice to encourage the sort of play that creates the best experience at the table. Especially how Hollow Earth Expedition creates a virtual game economy with the distribution and use of Style Points to drive player agency.
Everway’s tarot-like interpretive resolution system inspired the development of the dice pool system used in WFRP. While the interpretive narration was far more subjective and open-ended in Everway, the WFRP dice offer the objective results (success/failure & magnitude of effect) while also delivering subjective results (the source of the various symbols informing narrative) allowing players to easily add a level of storytelling interpretation and immersion to task resolution if they wish.
SA: A lot of those specifics go back to WFRP3’s use of dice, and thus one of our earlier topics. Some people have the visceral response that the game is too much of a "board game". How do you respond to that?
JL: There’s no denying that the new edition of WFRP is different from previous editions. And to many players, it’s probably different than any other roleplaying game they’ve encountered. The game does integrate a lot of components found in other types of games – cards, tokens, reference sheets, custom dice. For some players, the use of components more than pencil and paper may give off a boardgame vibe.
However, I believe the components help streamline the gameplay experience by breaking up information and game management more easily, allowing players to access the information they need quickly, and reduce reliance on tracking things with pencil and paper, or by flipping through several books.
I’ve been especially encouraged by the numerous responses and reviews posted by players who mentioned how the components helped make the game flow easier and allowed them to focus more on telling a cool story with their friends.
For many players, I’m confident they’ll be able to integrate the components easily and will appreciate the flexibility that the new edition’s approach offers. For others, it may not be their cup of tea. And that’s fine. “Different” can take some getting used to.
SA: I've always admired the ranged combat dice in Fantasy Flight Games' Descent, which organically encode not only success/failure but also the range at which you hit, all without needing a table. It feels to me like WFRP3 applies some of those same lessons learned from modern board games to a roleplaying system, via the construction of very specific game components. The main difference between your use of your own dice and counters for WFRP3 and my use of Litko markers and plastic miniatures in my current D&D game is one of specificity. (But what a difference it makes!)
We talked a bit about roleplaying influences. Were there any board games that had a particularly big influence on WFRP3's component design, and if so, how?
JL: Several cooperative games were influential, helping shape the spirit (if not the rules and mechanics) for the more party-oriented approach found in WFRP. Games like Minion Hunter, Pandemic, Battlestar Galactica, and Arkham Horror provided some very different ways to look at party and player dynamics. This helped when evaluating and fine-tuning some of the party mechanics, as well as the subtle design shift toward more intra-party concepts.
Overlord style games, where several players work together against a single player presenting an opposing force, also helped illustrate how the role of a single player influences the experience of everyone at the table.
Taking a look at the game responsibilities and involvement of the overlord player in games like Descent, Middle Earth Quest, Siege of the Citadel, and Fury of Dracula helped influence the “division of labour” in WFRP – who would be responsible for different actions at the table, how the role of the GM would be defined in the Game Master’s advice, reinforcing the concept of GM as facilitator and storyteller rather than adversary, and so on.
SA: So, we’ve talked a lot about influences on the new edition of the game and how they’ve resulted in something new and original in the roleplaying field. Let’s look at the other hand, now. How does this new edition of the game preserve the 25+ year history of the Warhammer Fantasy setting?
JL: Developing a product based on such a popular license was a really exciting opportunity – and I knew we had a long, storied pedigree to live up to. The background and flavour information goes through a rigorous approval process to make sure it fits Games Workshop’s view of the setting. The talented writers and artists helped ensure that the game retained the distinct blend of dystopian, grim fantasy and dark, sly humour. With Games Workshop’s approval and positive feedback to the game, it is extremely gratifying to know we did the setting proud.
Gameplay-wise, Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay provides a rules structure and game environment that allows players to explore the Warhammer Fantasy setting in a variety of ways – some groups may choose to play the game in a more heroic, high fantasy mode where the characters know they are heroes and act out of altruism, pride, or the need to do what is right and just. Other groups may prefer a grittier, more desperate setting where the characters are only heros by virtue of the fact that the stories revolve around their actions. Some players may enjoy combat-heavy campaigns, while others enjoy political and social intrigues. The rules can easily accommodate a variety of different play styles, each of which has a place within the Warhammer Fantasy setting.
The daemon’s in the details, as they say… The flavour text, the side bars, pull quotes, in-character comments, and background information all work together to help paint a picture of the Empire and the Old World. The art and design help convey the look and feel of the setting. The gameplay is tense, combat is dangerous, magic is risky, and players are constantly faced with tough decisions.
Each of these elements was carefully considered and developed with the big picture in mind. While the impact of one of these seemingly smaller elements may be overshadowed by others, together all of these details help present a game that pays homage to its predecessors while clearly striking out in its own direction.
SA: What should we expect to see in the future from Fantasy Flight Games' Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay line?
JL: We’ve got a lot of exciting things planned. While I can’t divulge any secrets about upcoming projects, I can say that we’ve got a wide variety of products in development that should appeal to GMs, players, and fans of the Warhammer Fantasy setting.
We’ll continue to explore different facets of the Empire and the Old World, add more depth and options to information found in the Core Set, and take a look at some of the iconic rivalries – the ancient enemies that have clashed with each other throughout the Old World’s history.
SA: Thanks again for your time and your insight on the new edition!
